No need to get all worked up, we are all here just being academic, i.e., rational without being emotional.


This thread is about my wanting to talk with people who have contacts with the Devil, so that I can get some real first hand information from them instead of from people who read about the Devil in ancient writings or works which are based on these obsolete writings.

In the process I seem to get the impression from the posts here that the Devil is an invention of man, because no one has ever brought the Devil to be interviewed on public TV before audience of millions, and can be encountered in life in the TV studio.


You also hold that the Devil is invented by man's mind, and you explain that the invention is useful for a scapegoat.

Scapegoat, is that why in the arts and in literature the poor Devil is portrayed as a goat. Poor goat. So also the serpent or snake.


But that is just one usefulness of the Devil, I mean the invention, to be a scapegoat for anything we are daring to commit that is going to get us in trouble but coward to admit to when caught, and must produce an alibi character, i.e., the Devil.


There are other usefulness angles to this invention, think about them.


There were men in the past so brilliant with their gifts in arts and in the sphere of knowledge that they also got seriously suspected of being in cahoots with the Devil if not his very impersonations. So, there, that is another usefulness of the invention of Devil, for an explanation of exceptional genius which we cannot accept to be within human possibilities, so we postulate the Devil as behind the genius.

Come to think about it, daimon is a Greek word for genius, it also stands for demon; perhaps I am wrong, correct me then people more learned than yours truly.

Think of that violinist and composer by the name of Niccolò Paganini, he was so very extremely versatile with the violin that his contemporaries could not imagine how he could be so skillful except with the connivance of the Devil.


And then also, Hollywood can always use the Devil for a film character.

Dracula or some vampire has already been recruited by Hollywood to be a good friend of mankind in fighting crimes, like what is the series? Forever [K]Night, something like that, but it is no longer running now on TV.


Now those who are Christians and take their Bible most literally, they believe that the Devil has an objective existence, not only in belief and in people's cranium or mind, but like as real though subtle as a bad odor that wafts by or as solid as some rock heavy gargoyle.

We want to ask these latters what role of usefulness to themselves and to us, that the Devil exists or that they the Christians want to believe the Devil and his henchmen sidekicks exist.


ardorge

This is what I wanted to avoid. I do not like trying to have an adult conversation with an individual that spouts like a petulant child. I assume nothing, but the whole "if there is good, there must be evil" theory is long based before Christianity even came into existence. I didn't read Nina's posts, so I know not of her views and therefor did not try to have an adult conversation with her about things that we have no undeniable proof of. I was simply stating a scientific theory, that if there is good there is bad. If there is light, there is darkness. If there is cold, there is hot. If there is fast, there is slow.

You classify me as living in a 'RPG' when in actuality I had to look up the definition for that acronym to make sure what it meant (I was never into the whole video game rave). You wrap insults around me as a way to secure yourself from my words because you find them so... threatening I guess? There is no reason to get so worked up over some sixteen year old male on the computer. I did not "attack" you, I placed my beliefs onto the table for you to look at. Not grab and tear. I did not demolish your beliefs, I just opened up a new, probably already spoke of, angle of view. If you do not want to talk about people and their views of the devil, why exactly are you in this forum?

I've read your past votes, and you seem to lash out quite often. Some of these lashes you performed were even unprovoked. If you wish not to hear other's opinion, come not to a community forum. Go to the library, grab a book, and find a quiet place where other people's thoughts will not cause you to become so irate.

Also, I had a little trouble understanding your point-of-view. Could you clear this part up for me?
Guess how much that means? ABSOLUTELY DICK.

Whether you were trying to call me a dick or whether your saying that all what was said means the absolution of the male genital; you caught me off guard. Anyway, if you want to get into the whole Christianity/Catholicism faith then let's do it! I can tell you want to.  Humans are apparently created in God's image. So, this would mean that naturally, humans could not be "perverted, corrupt, disgusting, etc.." HOWEVER! When Adam and Eve took the bite of that oh so forbidden fruit, they were swayed into the serpents (devil's) temptation. From here, they are constantly tempted to perform "corrupt and perverted" acts, crimes, and other such tribulations. But that's the whole Catholic/Christian religion, which you apparently find horrendous.

I can see what Nina and you are saying though, and I cannot deny the possibility, nor confirm it. You few say that how can we, the practically new world of life, come across and find the "correct" god or religion. Whether we see religion as a complex subject or a relatively simple one, you can compare it to something as simple as grade-school addition. For example.
There once was a big planet that was mostly water. Third planet from the sun. There were cavemen here, they walked on all fours and one day they were collecting oranges. They put three together and called it "Horge." (Horge indicating the number three).
On the flipside, there was a planet many many centuries ago that held mysterious creatures with eight limbs. They were very complex individuals and have learned a great deal. They were out looking for three bananas and put them together. They called this certain number of bananas "Torathy."


What I'm trying to say bluntly and very, very unplanned is that it is not hard to throw together something that can be taken so simple. Although these two different species called the number of fruit two completely different names and the fruits were not the same, when you get to the very core of it there were three objects. Three, solid objects. So, what I'm trying to boil down to is that just because one generation is newer than the other doesn't mean they can't come across it any less than the specie that existed long before them and still does now. I didn't explain it very well, but I'm sure you can figure out what I mean.
If not, I will elaborate on that point more thoroughly will more planning than the zero percentile I had in that example.

And even if the religion we follow isn't correct; yours, mine, Loki's, your neighbor's, etc... It's better than following nothing. For if there is a God that is stands as a fatherly figure to humankind, then we can assume he would appreciate us following natural law and our best attempt to do his "will."

This is simply a very blunt opinion I've con-gathered on the spot. So let's be adults and not tear it to shreds but instead, discuss it!  Just as I shall
do, with yours and everybody else who posts in a community forum.

Nope, I really did not know what you meant. I apologize for the misunderstanding.
I don't necessarily believe everything I wrote. I was merely debating and throwing out a few possible arrogant, annoying, and uppity theories.
I agree. Say even if the devil does influence the human race. Even if he did, the person commiting the sin, or act, would be fully responsible for it. The devil just influences and does not coerce (not including possession). However, whether or not I fully believe in this Catholistic view is faint but I do not deny the possibility.
No matter what, I agree that every act you do is solely your responsibility. That is taught through the martial arts, so I've come to believe in that statement.

Although it gave me a bit of a mild temper, I enjoyed your lashings. 
They allowed me to further contemplate and question my actual beliefs.
I look forward to future conversations.



DHI

think spoiled child, jealous of his little brothers and sisters because daddy loves them more and does so much for them...yet they are fleshy weak creatures that don't grasp the gifts they've been given...how would you feel being made inferior to pesky ants that can do no wrong and have the freedom to say bugger off;  we mess up, we deal with misery until we understand why we messed up, he messed up and is tossed into eternal darkness with those who agreed they were and should be first in line to the “Kingdom”

what was the best way to get  younger siblings in trouble?

tell them to do something you know would upset daddy while making them think it’s okay; from a biblical approach of things.


if you want judaic answers to your question, research...there's a lot out there from biblical point of views from a myriad of ideas and experiences, look into a new international version study bible, they have a delightful half page passage/half page definition of agreed thought by several hundred biblical experts concerning the usage and translation of the various books put together to make the bible, including an introduction about the history, associations and understandings about when and who wrote the books.

you'll be amazed how little about the devil is really in there, compared to contemporary thought.

Yay! welcome back jordy!

*does a happy dance and stops infront of  nina*

Care to join me?